Signal To Noise Podcast
The Signal to Noise podcast features conversations with people from all corners of the live sound industry, from FOH and monitor engineers, tour managers, Broadway sound designers, broadcast mixers, system engineers, and more.
Signal To Noise Podcast
261. Checking Back In With Up-And-Coming AV Pro Evan Turunen
It’s been a year of huge growth and focus shifts for Evan Turunen and Turunen Audio Visual — first featured in Episode 221 — so Andy and Sean wanted to check back in with Evan and see how things have changed and what he’s learned since he last visited. This episode is sponsored by Allen & Heath and RCF.
Topics discussed include making a similar major inventory pivot similar to the one Sean recently did for his company (Audio Engineers Northwest), moving the company into a proper warehouse after starting in a backyard shed, effectively planning and communicating logistics to a crew when you won’t be onsite yourself, remembering to maintain a life outside of work, and much more!
Episode Links:
Turunen Audio Visual
Turunen AV On Instagram
Steam Scrambled Eggs — Jody Williams
Buvette (New York/Paris/Tokyo/Seoul/Mexico City)
Twisted Sage Cafe (San Dimas, CA)
Episode 261 Transcript
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The Signal To Noise Podcast on ProSoundWeb is co-hosted by pro audio veterans Andy Leviss and Sean Walker.
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Episode 261 - Checking Back in with Evan Turunen
Note: This is an automatically generated transcript, so there might be mistakes--if you have any notes or feedback on it, please send them to us at signal2noise@prosoundweb.com so we can improve the transcripts for those who use them!
Voiceover: You’re listening to Signal to Noise, part of the ProSoundWeb podcast network, proudly brought to you this week by the following sponsors:
Allen & Heath, introducing their new CQ series, a trio of compact digital mixers for musicians, bands, audio engineers, home producers, small venues, and installers that puts ease of use and speed of setup at the heart of the user experience.
RCF, who has just unveiled their new TT+ Audio brand, including the high performance GTX series line arrays and the GTS29 subwoofer. Be sure to check it out at rcf-usa.com. That's rcf-usa.com.
Music: “Break Free” by Mike Green
Andy Leviss: Hey everybody, you're listening to Signal to Noise. I'm your host, Andy Leviss, and with me--back from a court mandated three time zones away --the Dionysian Feast to my Last Supper, mr. Sean Walker. What's up, Sean?
Sean Walker: What's up, dude? What's up, y'all? How you doing, buddy? How was your, uh, cruise ship vacation, fruity drinks with feet in the sand? Nah, it wasn't. We didn't do work, bro. You hung out, you drank fruity drinks, you ate
Andy Leviss: dude, I, I not only did work, I did like work on like an overnight shift while trying to still take advantage of the benefits of the cruise during the day. Man. And to be clear, it was an Alaska cruise, so it was not toes in the sand.
Sean Walker: Yeah, fair enough. Fair enough. How was it? Good? It was like five racks of Axiant, right? You thought maybe it was four channels, it ends up being
Andy Leviss: Yeah, I was like four or five channels and then I'm like, maybe he said four or five units.
It could go either way. I'll find out when I get there. And
Sean Walker: Whatever. You sorted it out, right?
Andy Leviss: yeah, no, it was good. It was, you know, coordinating that around stuff. And it's, you know, ships are cool because they're basically huge floating Faraday gauges. So no TV, like I did a scan when we, when I got on in the port in Vancouver and it was like, I think I see a little bit of a TV channel down in the noise floor there that, that sort of looks like TV.
So that was cool. Um. Yeah, and got to, got to play with the new, uh, I guess technically it's the beta of SoundBase Pro, which is their offline version, and they're betaing SoundSync, which is their monitoring extension for it, that basically can almost fully replace Workbench, and can like simultaneously monitor and control Sennheiser, Shure, and Wysicom all at once,
Sean Walker: Oh, dude, that's sweet.
Andy Leviss: Yeah, it's slick.
So like I had 20 channels and like you just, once you assign like link a channel in your coordination to the receiver, if you have to recalculate that frequency, it updates. And because, uh, and because ShowLink on Axiant talks to the receiver, Rather than to workbench, you don't even have to do anything with that, like literally at one point, because stuff shifted around, I had to recalculate a group of 20 frequencies, one of which was live at the time, and I hit recalculate in, in soundbase, they recalculated, immediately pushed to the receivers, and immediately pushed out to the transmitters over show link, without even a blip.
Sean Walker: That's awesome, dude.
Andy Leviss: pretty, it was pretty, it was one of those moments like, oh, I shouldn't have done that right now. He's walking out on, oh, it's fine. Cool. Great.
Sean Walker: Oh, no! I'm screwed! Oh, no, it's fine.
Andy Leviss: I had this moment of like, oh shit, I gotta, I gotta see what frequency that is fast and stop that one. And then I was like, oh no, no, nope, ShowLink did what it's supposed to. Love it.
Sean Walker: Alright, sweet.
Andy Leviss: Uh, what have you been up to?
Sean Walker: Uh, I mean, hanging with you and, uh, rocking shows. And surprisingly, this year, every one of them has something to do with water or a boat, apparently. Like, either in the name or actually, because we just did a festival called Rock the Boat, which was on land and not on a boat, but it was in a marina.
Yeah. And,
Andy Leviss: Semi false advertising, but we'll go with it.
Sean Walker: yeah, right. Totally. But, but that was sweet. Uh, RCF sent out a GTX 12 rig and a couple of dudes to, to rip it. We had Michael Lawrence out to systems engineer and, uh, Chris came out from the discord channel to, to rip. That was cool to meet. Meet him and they did a killer job and that PA was banging bro.
Andy Leviss: Yeah. And if folks want to hear more about that, we talked about it extensively on our live episode last week. So if you missed it, the audio is up in the podcast feed.
Um, and while we're doing other housekeeping stuff, real quick, I'll give you that regular reminder to if you're listening in a podcast app, whether it's Apple, Google, Overcast, any of those. If you don't actually subscribe to us in that app, go ahead and hit the subscribe button. And also while you're there, give us a review, especially five star reviews are great.
We love positive feedback, complaints.
Sean Walker: five star reviews only. I don't need any of them one star shits, bro. Just email me directly. Tell me, tell me what the one star shit you want to tell me. Leave five star reviews on the comments.
Andy Leviss: Yeah. Signal2Noise--that's signal, the number two, noise at ProSoundWeb. com. You can give us feedback, suggestions. Uh, if, if you think you'd make a great guest, if you know somebody, you'd make a great guest. If you don't
Sean Walker: your mom's a great guest, we'll talk to your mom too. It's fine.
Andy Leviss: Yeah, if you don't know somebody you think would be a ma would be a great guest and like can't intro still, you know, we if you can make an intro, we love it, but if you can't, like, throw us the name and we'll see if we can track them down if they seem cool.
Sean Walker: yeah, there you go. Totally.
Andy Leviss: yeah, and also, um, we, there's the link in the show notes, we've still got the voicemail box going if anybody's got questions they want to ask that we can have like guests answer
Sean Walker: We have a voicemail box?
Andy Leviss: yeah, we have a voicemail box, um,
Sean Walker: I gotta spam us, dude. I gotta start calling you, leaving you dirty messages. Like, hey, what are you wearing?
Andy Leviss: but yeah, or if you have tips and tricks like we'd love to put together, you know, a segment on an episode with a bunch of, you know, user tips and tricks, so if you want to call in and send those in or email them to us, uh, maybe we'll put them in a show in the future.
Sean Walker: Yeah, sweet.
Andy Leviss: with that five minutes of us blathering on, we should probably introduce our guest who's been waiting patiently here, uh, actually a returning guest, although I didn't get to hang with him last time, but Sean did, uh, Evan Turunen uh, is back for kind of a "what you been doing" check in.
Evan Turunen: What's
Sean Walker: Yeah, dawg. Welcome to the party.
Evan Turunen: Thanks, man. It's great to be here.
Sean Walker: What's new? What's up?
Evan Turunen: Well, pretty much everything.
Sean Walker: All right,
Evan Turunen: Since, uh, since the last time, there's been quite a number of changes. Um, so since I got home from tour, the company kind of flipped on its head in a, in a really great way. Um, not only did we move into a super awesome little shop, um, It's, uh, it's about 2000 square feet. Um, it's really local to me.
It's two stories. It's rad. Um, it's nice to have an actual spot to prep shows out of.
Sean Walker: Yeah, and let's get your cool logo behind you.
Evan Turunen: There you go. And for those that do and don't remember, um, I was working out of a shed in the past, in my backyard. I'm trying to run a full service production company out of there, um, and with volume, uh, as the company grows, that became incredibly difficult.
So the shop, um, if nothing else, is amazing for the fact that on weekends when we have three, four, five, um, the max so far has been eight shows in one day or weekend. Um, there's dedicated space to prep them, get consoles prepped, um, just packages sent out in a lot more organized manner, but also make it so that as an owner of a Thriving production company, I don't feel like I'm always super, super stressed out wondering if everything made it on the truck or not, because having a true spot to prep is a game changer.
Um, and you know, at the same time that I moved in, Business is growing, got more clients coming in. Um, we've made a pretty decent shift, um, while we're still staying in with the schools, universities, things like that, um, music festivals are starting to come our way, which is nice. Um, did our first one. A couple weeks ago, um, have done quite a number of them since, um, since it is summertime and those are happening a lot.
The final one is, uh, at the time of recording this upcoming Saturday. So we've got our last run, um, it'll be our 10th one of the, of the season, which is great. And you know, it's, it's awesome just to keep doing good shows and, you know, it's, it's super fun.
Sean Walker: That's awesome, dude. Congrats, dude. Way to, way to keep it ripping.
Evan Turunen: Thank you.
Sean Walker: I saw the, uh, the link of mixes you posted a couple days ago, or I don't remember what day it was, but that was banging, dude. That sounded great. Good work.
Evan Turunen: Yeah, that was a, uh, certainly not the most ideal circumstances that I was mixing under,
Sean Walker: Let me be honest, bro. They never are.
Evan Turunen: No.
Sean Walker: never are.
Evan Turunen: walking into a show that's, they only give you 8 mics, which 5 of them are 57s and 8s. Yeah. One is a 52, and then the other two are 58s,
Sean Walker: Oh, you got everything you need.
Evan Turunen: yeah, you got everything to do a rock show, um, and you know what?
It was cool. Busted out a really killer mix, and it, that's actually the reason why we have the festival, um, this upcoming weekend is the headlining band fell in love with the way that it sounded and said, hey dude, can we book you for something bigger than this show, and Here we
Sean Walker: awesome,
Andy Leviss: yes, you can,
Sean Walker: Yes, you sure can. Give me your money.
Evan Turunen: You can't.
Yeah. So that went from, you know, that tiny little show where I provided nothing other than myself to, um, this festival being. Uh, a 20 foot wide stage with video wall in the back, tons of movers, a nice big RC FPA and then, um, you know, consoles and mics and all those things. It'll be a good show.
Sean Walker: it.
Andy Leviss: so, and, and you mentioned an RCF array, and I know for a while, you, you have been a Meijer shop, so that's another recent change, right? You're going down the Sean Walker school of audio company.
Evan Turunen: I am,
Andy Leviss: evil thing with his fingers.
Evan Turunen: yes, that is a, that is a recent switch as of, uh, this past week, actually. It's one that I'm, I'm really, really excited for, um. You know, a lot of people talk about RCF as like, oh my gosh, it's so great for the money. I think RCF is just great in general, um, after listening to these boxes and taking them out on shows, um, they, they rip.
They're great. Um, super loud, super clean, um, and you know, I'm loving the results that I'm getting out of them and it's a, it's going to be a good opportunity for the company.
Sean Walker: I gotta be honest, dude. I wish they made a SIVA sexier shit like that because the SIVA is just It's sexy as shit, bro.
Evan Turunen: Yeah, you know, I will say we,
Sean Walker: sorry, go ahead.
Evan Turunen: uh, we did a show this past weekend and, uh, The client request was for Seva and the whole time I was thinking, I don't know why somebody else doesn't make a product that looks like this. Because it seems like such an untapped market.
Sean Walker: Totally. And the NXL 24 is close. It sounds great, but it's not the same dude.
Evan Turunen: It doesn't look the same.
Sean Walker: Totally. Yeah. It's got way more output, but it doesn't look the same
Evan Turunen: Absolutely.
Andy Leviss: it's solidly the, hey, can we stop on the way home and get SIVA? No, we have SIVA at home and then the SIVA at home is this. Or, or, what, what, yeah, what you ordered on Temu and what you got.
Sean Walker: yet. It's it's a, and it sounds beautiful and it fricking looks beautiful. It's dude, it's killer for the right applications. And I just, I keep telling Tarek, like, yo man, I'm gonna need me one of them, dude, like, gotta make you one of them. He's
Andy Leviss: Yeah, just like make that, but a little sexier.
Sean Walker: Yeah, dude, could you put some Italian sexy curves on that bitch like it's a Ferrari and send it over, please?
You know?
Evan Turunen: And make it powered.
Sean Walker: yeah, right. Totally.
Andy Leviss: And maybe make it available in white.
Sean Walker: Yeah,
Evan Turunen: you go.
Sean Walker: a lot of their stuff is available in white, which is cool.
Evan Turunen: I think the second somebody makes that, it is going to flip the corporate market just on its head. Because if there's more than one competitor in a space, you know,
Sean Walker: Texting now.
Andy Leviss: Yeah, I mean that's the thing is like, I have like, so many shops I work with that like, like I have a shop that's predominantly a Martin shop, but they stock Sivas, cause the geeks that need Sivas need Sivas.
Evan Turunen: We, uh, there's, there's a lot of shops around here. Um, cause I mean, we're in California, there's a lot of Meijer around. Um, I would say that a lot of, I would say a lot of the Meijer houses still own SIVA. They could, you know, even the biggest one, they still do just because it fits a market that is so prominent for everybody.
And that is corporate.
Andy Leviss: and I mean, I will say the flip side of that on some corporate is, there are shows that people will stick SIVA on that are not shows you should stick SIVA on. definitely see it get used as a, we've got a relatively quick thing to set up that looks pretty, just throw it out there, and it's like, you're putting four executives on lavs directly in front of a hundred and something degree white box, can we not?
Evan Turunen: Yeah. Uh huh. Yeah. It's wide, it's wide line levels of wide.
Andy Leviss: Yeah, it's definitely one of those, like, anytime somebody hasn't used it, you're like, okay, do me a favor, before you do anything else, put music on in it, and walk the pattern and understand what it does, because it's both wider than you think it is, but it's also in certain frequencies not as wide as you think it is.
Evan Turunen: Totally.
Andy Leviss: Which was actually a thing I was taught by past guest Jim VanBurgen at the venue he used to work at that I worked at. Uh, that uses those a lot for, and again, that's another one that's a D& B house for everything except for a couple sets of Sivas.
Sean Walker: Totes, dude. Totes. Just a killer, it's just a killer product.
Evan Turunen: Totally.
Andy Leviss: So you've been, like, selling off all your Meyer stuff as you, as you get the RCF in?
Evan Turunen: I have, yeah, we switched to, um, a bunch of their NX 932s, um, for just a good utility box and then NXL 24As and then 8008s and I will tell you, um, you know, I love all the boxes, that 8008 is ridiculous for what it is, I got it.
Andy Leviss: hear Sean's nod right now.
Evan Turunen: I got it thinking like, oh cool, dual 18 sub, great. Man, it is punchy, it is loud, it is clean, and I, you know, I open up smart thinking like, okay, let's see what I got to do this box. Really a whole lot of anything. It's, it just sounds good the second you turn it on, um, and it's light. Like, oh my god,
Sean Walker: And what were you coming from before?
Evan Turunen: uh, 300 pounds a sub for 700 HPs with Rigging.
Sean Walker: Gross.
Evan Turunen: You know, it's a great box,
Sean Walker: a good sub, but 300 pounds of sub sucks when you're, like, what are you, a buck 15 soaking wet?
Evan Turunen: yeah, uh huh,
Sean Walker: Yeah, yeah.
Evan Turunen: sounds about right. Uh,
Andy Leviss: He's like, yeah, we'll go with that, we'll go with
Evan Turunen: yeah, we'll go with that. Uh,
Andy Leviss: Wait till you're our age, dude.
Sean Walker: Yeah, right? Yeah. Enjoy, enjoy being skinny right now, because the dad bod kicks in fast when you get into your 40s and have kids.
Evan Turunen: there you go. Uh, yeah, we'll, we'll, we'll see about that. But yeah, no, I mean, just off of the factor of we were, with those subs, the, the previous subs, You know, they wrote on caster carts, which is awesome for if you are a touring house and you're coming off of semis and you want to drop, you know, four carts a side of subs into your arena.
That's super cool. Um, I'm not doing that. I'm dropping two subs, four subs, maybe eight on a show. Um, and we're in a 16 foot box with, you know, crews that are not 30 people big. They are Mate, five, six people on a nice show. So having something that it can go one sub at a time, right into a truck, that's great.
So just off of that factor, if nothing else, is amazing.
Sean Walker: Plus, you're able to sell 2 subs and buy 4, which is fucking awesome, if you're in a company.
Evan Turunen: There you go. That is also a great,
Sean Walker: twice as much for twice as many subs. And in the market you're in, you probably didn't have to change your pricing, you could probably charge the same for your RCF gear that you could for the Meyer gear, and now you got twice as much RCF gear to charge for them, so you're literally A cash machine at this point.
Evan Turunen: I'm,
Andy Leviss: Evan's clients who are listening to this episode, in which case you're the exception and you get the special
Sean Walker: Yeah, yeah, yeah, you got the friend deal. You get the bro deal, but anybody else who's not listening, cash machine.
Evan Turunen: exactly. And, uh, it's also nice because, um, there is a huge rental house for it right down the street. Um, they've got a ton more, but also in this switch, I have physically more boxes now. So needing rentals is not as common, which is amazing.
Sean Walker: And not only does that save you the rental price, but also the labor and time and trucking to go get it and bring it back, tech it, return it. You know what I mean? Like it's such a pain to rent stuff.
Evan Turunen: especially, you know, being in LA, there's always traffic. Rentals are not fun to go and pick up. That is minimum, um, because I am in the valley. So I'm not in LA, but I'm adjacent to it. So with all the rental houses being in LA, I have minimum three hour round trip because of traffic.
Sean Walker: Brutal, brutal. So,
Evan Turunen: just a little bit.
Sean Walker: so because. I know where you're at, specifically, have you seen the movie yet, dude?
Evan Turunen: I have not.
Sean Walker: You son of a bitch. Cause there is absolutely something afoot at the Circle K, bro. You gotta, you gotta go see it, dude. You gotta go see it.
Evan Turunen: And I, and you have seen it yourself. That circle cage really is there.
Sean Walker: It sure is, dude. I was waiting for my phone booth to show up and everything. I was like, where they at, dawg? I'm gonna go get me some time traveling on.
Andy Leviss: If, if it makes you feel better. Evan, I've learned in the last year that Kate had never seen the movie until last year. So as long as you see it in the next, you know, 15, 20 years, you're, you're ahead of the curve on that one.
Evan Turunen: There we go. Perfect. You know what? The girlfriend and I are trying to spend some time together before, uh, she goes back to school. So I think we have a movie night coming up and, uh, that sounds like the perfect choice.
Sean Walker: you go.
Andy Leviss: Yeah, that one's good. I actually, I haven't seen the newest, like the third sequel they did. I heard that one is good. The middle one is, it's
Sean Walker: one's the one, the first one's the one, bro. Just watch the first one and don't just skip the rest of the nonsense. It's it. You'd never get those hours back in your life, dude.
Evan Turunen: Nice.
Sean Walker: The other, the other one to go see in case you haven't, because it's full of like great one liners is Oh Brother Where Art Thou with George Clooney.
If you haven't seen that, go see it. Cause you can always steal some of those one liners like, damn, we're in a tight spot because it works every time.
Andy Leviss: I haven't actually, I haven't actually seen that one either. I
Sean Walker: Oh bro, you gotta go see it. It's it, you know, they're, they're silly movies. It's not like An incredible piece of filmmaking that you're going to like give it high ratings, you're just going to go and go, damn, we're in a tat spot.
Andy Leviss: Yeah. See, there's like that line, that, that continuum. Cause then you get to like Lebowski where it is a great movie and there are also great one
Sean Walker: Yeah, there you go. Totally. You mean like super troopers
Andy Leviss: Yeah. Yeah. But it's like, you know, just how many things in my life I say, you know, just tied the room together.
Sean Walker: a hundred percent, dude, the ringer can't look empty, bro. You know what I mean?
Andy Leviss: Yeah, and, and, uh, and, uh, I feel like both of us have, have, uh, fallen subject at times to, you're not wrong, you're just an asshole.
Sean Walker: Hey, hey, hey, I said I was sorry. It was one time, dude. All right, it was
Andy Leviss: Um, well, get, get him back on the rails before, now that we've got, like, the unofficial restaurant recommendations Google sheet, like, now we're gonna have, like, a movie and TV one too. But, um, but before we get further down that, down that road, um, maybe back to, back to like the business stuff. So, Evan, you're, you know, when we, when the collective we last talked to you, you were on tour and doing that.
Was that a, is that something you want to do again? Is that like a scratch the itch, but now I'm going to do my thing here, or, or, you know, Whatever happens, happens.
Evan Turunen: So that was, that's actually like a really tough question. I was thinking about it the other day because I love touring and I think it's super, super fun, um, but as this company grows, my ability to step away from it for two months at a time, three months at a time, is becoming so much less and less, so I don't know how feasible it is anymore, um, because just in that year's time since we last spoke, you know, this company has gone from being something where it's like, wow, this is a great company, to this is.
Very real, very full time, we are doing many shows a week, um, and I don't know how easy it is to just say, alright, bye, hope the company's there when I come back in two months. You know, that's
Sean Walker: So you went from your mom's real proud of you to everybody's real proud of you. Is that what you're saying? Yeah.
Evan Turunen: Thanks man.
Andy Leviss: I mean, look, man, you posted not only on the business side, but you posted that mix we were talking about before. And like the only feedback you got from Ryan fucking John was, yeah, maybe just tweak the reverb a little bit.
Evan Turunen: That was a, that was a proud moment. I texted Sean last night and I was like, yeah dude, he likes my mix, that's uh, I think that's good for my year.
Andy Leviss: Possibly even your metric gear.
Sean Walker: I had to quickly scurry and go, what mix are we talking about? Where are we going? I had to go find it, and then I had to listen. I was like, oh, yeah, totally banging. Great job, kid.
Evan Turunen: Thanks man.
Sean Walker: Oh, man, it was awesome. All right, well, changing PAs. You're welcome. Changing, uh, ripping companies. Doing shows just pretty much ripping that a boy good work, dude
Evan Turunen: thanks man. It's still a ton of work. You know, I'm here every day. Uh, but that's, that's just part of it. And I'm excited for the future growth because every day I get a little bit closer to, um, You know, adding more people on. So then one shop task that I have becomes somebody else's and the company grows a little bit.
So it feels like every day that I spend, you know, doing new shows, getting new clients, um, it's just a, it's an added growth to the company as a whole, not just for my own personal gain, which is great.
Sean Walker: totally and watch what you will find if you haven't already found which I think it sounds like you already have but there will start to be tasks are They're out of your pay grade, right? Somebody that makes a shop rate of Needs to be doing those tasks and somebody that makes a president of a company rate needs to be going and selling shows and not wrapping XLR cables.
And that is not that that is beneath you. That's not what I'm saying at all, because you'll still do plenty of that. What I am saying is your time is better used selling shows. So somebody else can have a job doing shop stuff. Otherwise that person doesn't have a job doing shop stuff because you're not selling shows, right?
And that sounds like that balance is coming quickly for you where you're like, all right, dude, I need a couple of full time dudes so that I can keep ripping Slinging shows and doing customer service stuff and not, you know, prepping and de prepping quite as hard and just over, just checking out the prep, making sure it's all good and programming your console.
If you're going to go mix or whatever,
Evan Turunen: And I'm thankful that I have a, I have a great team behind me that they are, they are stepping up and willing to, you know, take over new roles, even if it's something that they don't know. Um, they're willing to learn it, which is awesome. And I'll also, um, a number of them are part time right now. I don't have anyone full time, but, um, all of them know, like, hey, if you, if you stick around, For, you know, you give me a couple of years, you know, maybe it's just a year, but give me a little bit of time.
You will all have a, a full time place here, which is, I appreciate that they, you know, see that in the company and are willing to put in the effort for it, which is, that makes me feel like I'm doing something good.
Sean Walker: totally dude. And you in turn have to take care of them and make sure that you make good on your word and you give them a full time place and a good place to work and a good, consistent paycheck that makes their life easier and better. So when they're, Kick an ass for you. They're like, you know getting the reward in their bank account and a fun place to work that They want to come to work every day because we got we got a hard job man You know what?
I mean in the in the events business, whatever that means to your particular company, right? We got odd hours. We got long hours You can mitigate that a ton, but you can't get rid of it. Like you're, you're never nine to five ish. You know what I mean? You're always longer than that or different than that or whatever.
So, you know, creating a place people want to work with a fun vibe or whatever vibe you want to create. It doesn't have to be fun. It could be serious as shit if you want, but you know, make sure that you got the people that align and take good care of them, which you're already doing. So good on you, buddy.
Evan Turunen: Thanks, man. You know, I, I think a lot of it goes back to my, when I was in school, I was In a lot of leadership classes, I don't know, as part of student government, things like that. Um, and I've noticed a lot of those leadership lessons that they would talk about like, Oh, one day when you're 25, you're going to apply this to your job.
Um, I can see myself applying a lot of those things that, you know, people that I look up to, or just people that I've heard from in general, I'm starting to apply those things, which is, it's interesting to see how much of a Leadership role this has become and not just cool. Let's do a show. Like I, I have to be a company leader at this point.
Um,
Sean Walker: Can you teach me how to do that when you, when you get it sorted out, please? Yeah.
Andy Leviss: Ken confirm, I've been on one of his sites.
Sean Walker: Yeah.
Andy Leviss: you bud.
Sean Walker: Yeah. Yeah.
Evan Turunen: but yeah,
Sean Walker: That's awesome, dude. That's awesome. I'll tell you as when you're in a leadership role, as Andy will confirm, you just walk around the job site, offering people sparkling water and telling bad jokes. That's all it
Evan Turunen: There you go. A
Andy Leviss: And occasionally lighting a cigar.
Sean Walker: Yeah, yeah, yeah, totally. Yeah, you gotta have cigars.
That's right. Totally.
Evan Turunen: And, and you gotta, you gotta spend time just like talking to your client about something completely unrelated, you know, while everybody else works really, really hard,
Sean Walker: Totally. Totally. Yeah. Yo, man, you wanna go fishing? Let's go play some golf. I suck at golf. I actually, that's a bad example, but
Evan Turunen: I'll stick to taking people out to dinner,
Sean Walker: There you go. Everybody likes dinner, dude. Everybody likes dinner.
Evan Turunen: it's hard to say no to food.
Sean Walker: Yeah, for sure, dude. For sure. Well, cool, dude. Music festivals, private events, all kinds of stuff. That's great. How are the festivals going? Good? You guys stoked on those?
Evan Turunen: They are good, um, California heat is brutal, um, just because it's, I mean, I don't have humidity, like, uh, you two do, it's all dry heat, but, when it's over a hundred and you're doing an eight hour festival, that is, Um, you know, that
Andy Leviss: at a certain point without the humidity, it's, it's harder because you don't realize it's as hot until you, until quite longer.
Evan Turunen: and you get to that point too, where if it is over a hundred gear is overheating, um, you know, there's a lot more at play than just, oh, wow, it's hot. Like it becomes a, a gen, like a true. Concern at that point, um, you know, for the safety of your crew, for the safety of your gear, all that stuff. But, you know, we've gotten through all of them, which is great.
Um, there have been a number of overheated laptops and iPads on every show. Um, you know, you can't get past that too much, but always making sure that there's, you know, Ample amounts of fresh water that is cold and in a cooler at all times and just bring all those big shop fans, point them at everybody who's doing something
Sean Walker: Totally.
Evan Turunen: it works.
Sean Walker: Totally, dude. Do you guys, uh, have, man, I want to say seasons, but that's not really right because You do, but do events change for you as the year changes, as it gets hotter and colder? Like here in Seattle, we do, you know, concerts, outdoor concerts, festivals in the summertime, and then it goes to corporate in the wintertime, because the weather sucks in the wintertime here, right?
There's no, no outdoor festivals or anything. Does that continue year round for you because you pretty much have nice weather all year round? Or does it ebb and flow like that also, or how does that work in the different part of the country?
Evan Turunen: It's very seasonal, but I'd say that my view is a little bit more biased because I'm in a Very seasonal client area, meaning like I do universities and high schools, um, as my main source of income. So we go from beginning of the year is welcome back to school. It's football game season, so we do lots of PAs for football games with DJs or just general announcements.
Um, welcome back stuff has That's a lot of just speakers on sticks, dropped at different school sites, putting up LED wall, um, and then you go right into homecoming season, which is, is still like half outdoors, half indoors, um, for those big school dances. Then it really jumps, um, I will say during the wintertime we really don't do anything outdoors.
That's like theater productions and Christmas tree lightings and holiday parties.
Sean Walker: Cause it gets really cold down there, down into the high 60s, low 70s in the winter time.
Evan Turunen: you go. Yeah. That's just, it's too cold, man. You got to put on a sweatshirt. I don't want to put on a sweatshirt.
Sean Walker: Dude, we did a Christmas tree lighting last year, or maybe the year before, and it was like below freezing and we were just like shivering, trying not to die, little space heater going, doesn't help, you know?
And you're like, oh man, I gotta take off my flip flops and actually put on shoes? This sucks. What?
Evan Turunen: I think that the only time that we can't like truly be outdoors is end of January, Early February, cause it does, despite being California, it does tend to rain during that time. Um, especially this past year, we got a lot of rain. So, you know,
Sean Walker: I think both times I was down there, it was fucking raining, bro. I was
Evan Turunen: I think you brought it with you.
Sean Walker: I did.
Andy Leviss: Yeah, you brought the Seattle rain with
Sean Walker: I did, totally. I was like, what is happening right now? Usually when I head up to NAMM, it's like Sunny and beautiful. I'm like, God, this is great. Cause Seattle sucks right now with the weather. You know what I mean?
And then I got down there. I was like, what the fuck is happening? Seattle rain right now,
Evan Turunen: Yeah, I remember prepping, or helping prep for, um, a demo at NAMM and it was pouring down rain as we were trying to send a bunch of PA onto a truck, which was, you know, fun.
Sean Walker: but you need it though. Like you need the rain. You can't complain about it. You know what I mean? But
Evan Turunen: Exactly. And right now, with it being over a hundred outside, I would totally take some rain.
Sean Walker: right. Totally. Oh
Evan Turunen: Because this shop doesn't have any AC and it is brutally hot up here.
Sean Walker: Yeah. Fair enough. Fair enough. You get one of those like AC units that just blows the, with the hose out the garage door or something to
Evan Turunen: Yeah,
Sean Walker: it down a few degrees,
Evan Turunen: Yeah, at least, at least ten degrees would be great. Make it much more
Sean Walker: just take the edge off a little bit.
Evan Turunen: Uh huh. Yeah. Yeah.
Sean Walker: Right, totally. Well, sweet, dude. New shop, new gear, new clients. Like, you're rippin dude.
Evan Turunen: It's growing. I, uh, you know, it feels like a whole new company from where it was a year ago. Um, We're doing a lot of the same shows, but so many new ones now that it just feels like a totally different thing. And I love that. Um, because when we last talked, um, I felt a little bit like I was stuck in one corner of a market where I was doing the same 10 shows for the same 20 clients.
And that was awesome. That was super good point to be at. But now it feels like, wow, I've got this just wide spread of. Different people who hit me up, totally different spread of shows, which is also nice for my crew because now they're not doing the same 40 shows, you know, every couple months.
Sean Walker: out of their mind.
Evan Turunen: it's not all school dances, which school dances are great. I think I have heard Yeah by Usher a good hundred times this year.
Sean Walker: This year
Evan Turunen: Yeah.
Sean Walker: shoot me in the face.
Andy Leviss: At least it's not Pharrell.
Sean Walker: Alright, I don't know. Both, both those are super talented artists, but if you hear anything a hundred times, you're like, I'm over it, dawg. You know what I
Evan Turunen: uh, yeah, they all have the same playlist. So it's nice for everyone's sanity to go, Hey, you know, we just did a run of 10 school dances, let's go do. A couple corporate shows, and then let's all go make some live music and have some fun. So it's nice that that spread is there.
Andy Leviss: So, how much of that is, like, natural growth that just adds your reputations and spreading people have sought you out, and how much of that is stuff that you've kind of chased after? Yep.
Evan Turunen: I would say the music festivals I chased after, um, that was an area that I wanted to grow into. Um, and so I did originally for the first handful of them, I'd say the first five, I was intentionally trying to find clients that could book me for that. Um, and we did, uh, but otherwise it's all natural growth, which, you know, is really cool.
Um, you know, I, I, I'm going to do another round of reaching out to new opportunities here, um, coming up once we, once we slow down a little bit. Uh, but yeah, it's, it's really, it's really natural growth and just developing a, a good name for myself around here, which is awesome.
Sean Walker: Good job, dude. The trick is to reach out before you slow down so that you don't slow down. Just keep that leapfrog going. Keep that leapfrog going.
Evan Turunen: 100%.
Sean Walker: Totally. Well, it sounds, it sounds like you took the horrible advice I gave you and just called a motherfucker, and it's working
Evan Turunen: do that. Yeah, that's exactly how I, I, the first. Literally the first five music festivals was, I'm gonna call up these festivals around here and say, hey dude, you guys need PA, we can do PA stage, we can do all the things. If you want one company to do all of your production for your festival, I'm your guy.
And that, that worked for a lot of people, which is really nice. And so being able to just. Turnkey, full service, here's a whole package, it's wonderful. And from those first festivals branched out into more, because the second that I showed on, I'm pretty big into pushing our shows on social media, um, I keep up with our company Instagram and Facebook pretty heavily,
Sean Walker: What's social media?
Evan Turunen: I know you don't have any, uh,
Sean Walker: Oh, bro, I'm horrible at it.
Evan Turunen: I, I know, yeah,
Sean Walker: You want to be my social media guy? I'll pay you to be the social
Evan Turunen: there we go. Yeah, I'll take some photos for you, post them, put some great captions on there, done. Um, but yeah, no, so when we did the first couple festivals, I showed off pictures from them, and that branched out into even more, because I think that was kind of the call to people around me who, you know, some of these festivals are coming from other production companies, so it was the call of, hey, we can do this, here's, here's this show that we are able to put on that is at scale, that maybe you haven't seen us do before, and we're open to doing more of them, and it.
It worked out. So, you know, it kind of just snowballed after getting one bunch more. Okay.
Sean Walker: Attaboy. Good work. That's
Evan Turunen: Thanks, man. And they're all back for next year. All of them want it back.
Sean Walker: Nice. Means you knocked it out of the park. Good job, buddy.
Evan Turunen: Thanks, man.
Sean Walker: Now keep reaching out so you got more and you can double, double, triple, quadruple stack those bad boys. On top of each other.
Evan Turunen: And maybe next year we'll, uh, we'll do follow up part two and I'll be in a shop that's three times this size and doing three times as many shows.
Sean Walker: Oh man, if you can be doing three times as many shows in the same shop, that's even better because you keep your cost lower.
Evan Turunen: We love low costs.
Sean Walker: the keep, the trick is to keep the money in your bank account and not in a lease someplace.
Evan Turunen: That gets me, uh, you know, it gets me into a house faster. So I love the sound of that.
Sean Walker: I'll tell you as somebody who shells out way too much money in other things every freaking month, keep it as low as possible, as long as possible, because it will get there whether you like it or not. So, you know, hold off, bro. Hold off. Just triple, quadruple stack them cases to the ceiling if you have to, until you absolutely must, cannot deal with that shop anymore, and then go find another shop.
Evan Turunen: I was talking to a production company owner of a guy who owns a much larger company than me in L. A. And he, um, was just talking about what it's like owning a company at that scale. And we were just having a conversation about that. And the number that he threw out for what he's paying in expenses, just fixed costs, I, I damn near cried.
I don't, like, that is, it was double what the entire company, Makes right now and just thinking about that is wild.
Sean Walker: Totally, dude. Totally. One, one of your shows doesn't even pay for the fuel in the trucks.
Evan Turunen: No, exactly. Yeah. It's, it's crazy where, but that's so normal to so many people, because when you get to that scale, there are costs that come with that. Because if you have to staff 60 people, that's, that's certainly not cheap.
Sean Walker: isn't. Not if you want good help, it's not. I mean, it's not cheap, period, but if you want great help, it's certainly not cheap.
Evan Turunen: Oh yes,
Sean Walker: And great help keeps the phone calls to you down, and the clients happy, and it's worth every frickin penny to hire frickin rippers rather than first timers, dude.
Evan Turunen: totally. Yeah. I'm, I, I've been expanding the freelance. I call it my freelancer database. Um, it's a document that I've got on my computer and I keep expanding it with just great people because. You know, the less that I have to worry about how somebody can do their job or not on a show site, especially as we do volume and I can't be there for every show, it's so important.
So,
Sean Walker: Absolutely. That's awesome. That's freaking super cool, dude. Great job.
Evan Turunen: Thank you. Yeah, I'm very proud of what I'm doing and I'm very grateful too that I have the opportunity to do this, um, at this scale at, you know, 19.
Sean Walker: Yeah, dude. Well, we're proud of you. We're freaking stoked for you, dude. And we're, we're rooting for you and hoping to help in any way we can. Keep, keep the questions and whatever else coming so we can help, however, and hopefully you can take over the world. I got this sound company in Seattle. You can buy one someday when you're ready, bro.
Evan Turunen: Hey, yeah, I'm great. I would love to, uh, let's do it.
Sean Walker: Yeah,
Andy Leviss: Yeah, have your people call his people.
Evan Turunen: Yeah,
Sean Walker: they'll sort it, they'll sort it out. I got this, uh, I got this vacation I got to take something for the first time in decades, bro. Come on.
Evan Turunen: perfect. You go take that.
Sean Walker: Oh man, I wish. The wife would love that.
Andy Leviss: I was going to say the one piece of advice I'll give you with talking about working every day is learn from Sean's lesson when we talked about it a lot before and don't, don't forget to take vacations and take that time off and burn yourself out.
Sean Walker: Dude, totally.
Evan Turunen: That's, that's something that, um, my girlfriend has been pushing me for a lot, which I'm thankful that she has been, um, of like, Hey, been in the shop until 10 PM for the past three days. Like let's, let's take it, let's take a day, let's go have dinner, like work during the day, but let's go, let's go do some dinner, you know, let's go out.
Let's do something fun. Get your mind off work. And, uh, it's very nice that she, you know, sees what I'm doing, but also tries to keep my own. Personal life in mind, because it's really easy to get caught up with, yeah man, we could, we could build another three racks of wireless for a show that's in a week right now, because that, that's a good thing to do at 10 30 at night, you know, it's really
Sean Walker: else are you going to
Evan Turunen: that mindset.
There you go.
Andy Leviss: I think I've talked before on the show about the 10pm decision threshold, haven't I?
Sean Walker: No, but now I want to hear it.
Andy Leviss: learned this from a friend in the Broadway sound world, Alex Newman, who has a rule on any show that Alex is the designer associate on, um, which I think may have come from our other mutual friend, Dylan Cody, uh, that 10pm is the bad decision threshold.
Everybody agrees up front, no decisions are going to be made after 10pm, because no matter what it is, You're going to want to change it the next morning when you come back with fresher eyes.
Sean Walker: All right. All right. Fair enough. That, uh, that pretty much bums me out. Cause every decision we've made has been after 10 PM and
Andy Leviss: I mean, if it's working for
Sean Walker: yeah, right.
Andy Leviss: yours might be the no decision before noon then.
Sean Walker: No, no, man. I'm just making bad jokes as always. Oh, well, is there anything we should have asked you that we didn't, or you wish we'd asked you Evan, anything that we missed or didn't give you a hard enough time about? Cause we're, we're good at giving you a hard time. All
Evan Turunen: are. No, uh, I don't think so. Not that I can think of.
Sean Walker: right. Andy.
Andy Leviss: if you, if you could go back to, to Evan a year ago or so, when, when you were last on the show and give that Evan a piece of advice from today, what would it be? Is there one thing you would do different in the last year?
Evan Turunen: Yes, actually. Um, focusing, you know, I focused on prep, but not in the right way. Um, and I realized that because when I got right back from tour, um, the first weekend that I was home. It was 7 shows in one day, followed by 4 shows the next day, so that was 11 shows in one weekend, uh, and
Sean Walker: That's a lot of shows for a lot of companies, especially for a one man army company. That's frickin mental. In case the rest of you out there don't know what a big deal is,
Andy Leviss: out of the shed,
Evan Turunen: I was still out of a shed at that point.
Sean Walker: that's a fuckin mental weekend for anybody else that doesn't grasp the scope of that.
Evan Turunen: I played some crazy mental gymnastics, and I did not understand, going into it, because I had never done that volume, how important specific types of prep were. Meaning, I should have gone through and like, pre addressed lighting fixtures, I should have pre built show files, stuff that in hindsight is like, wow, that's really stupid, why didn't I do that?
It made those shows a little bit more complicated. All of them happened, all of them are returning, all the clients were happy. It added a ton of unnecessary headache that when I came back to it and we did, um, more shows than that, we did shows one day, seven shows the next, um, on our peak weekend in April.
Um, it was the weekend of April 27th. I very vividly remember that. I was in a shop, I knew how to prep for it, and all of those shows happened so much easier with From my understanding, at least from what the crews told me, zero problems. Um, which is nice because the prep happened, it was there, um, you know, it was a lot easier now that I wasn't trying to make everybody else do it once they were on site.
It was done before the truck was overloaded.
Sean Walker: So what are some of those things that, that you changed in your prep from the last time to this time, other than what you already said, pre addressed lights?
Evan Turunen: So, um, It's a lot more of just building profiles for things. So there are, you know, show files for consoles are already done, show files for lighting consoles. Um, those were done in the past, but they're done in a little bit more of an organized fashion that is labeled easier for people to get to on site.
Um, and really just labeling stuff. Um. You know, cases are, have always been labeled, but they're labeled in a different way now that just makes a little bit more sense of like, Hey, here's these things, but here's what you're going to use these things for. Um, cause we're sending it when it's school dance season, that's when we get the most volume.
And that's when I'm sending out five of the same setup in one night. You know, seven of the same rig in one night. And so they're all cookie cutter. So if I can build, Hey, this set of XLR is for this, this set of Edison is for this, you know, because on those high volume nights, I'm hiring people who may have never worked for me or met me in the past.
And this is their first time. So making it as easy as possible for them. And thinking of it, thinking of it, like, From a perspective of how would somebody that knows nothing about my company, nothing about my gear, and nothing about my shows be able to put this together as quickly as possible. So that's what I started doing, and it has made the world of a difference.
And also, I've started making videos, which sounds kind of weird, but what I
Sean Walker: I got in trouble for that one time.
Andy Leviss: Different thing,
Sean Walker: Oh, oh, sorry, sorry, sorry.
Evan Turunen: I'll pull up, uh, you know, a sitemap, a gear list, and just take out my iPhone, and I'll walk through, like, hey, I'm gonna point out this thing on the screen and show you, hey, this is here, this is here, your load in is here, here's your path to load in, because I'm the one that does all the sitewalks, and it's a lot easier to explain that over video than to try and type it out and make some confusing mess of a paragraph of, hey, here's how this show's gonna work, here's how you load in, this, that, what, when, Next thing.
And so just showing it in a simple video that's, you know, two, three minutes long, the walkthrough for the show, walks them through, Hey, here's your, who you're going to talk to. All these things works out way better than signing a document in my, in my case,
Sean Walker: That's awesome.
Andy Leviss: Just picturing you sitting there like Steve Kornacki ing the shit out of, out of your job site.
Evan Turunen: pretty much,
Sean Walker: That's rad.
Evan Turunen: but you know, it makes it successful. And this year, um, cause you know, school is about to start back up for everybody, so the second that we hit August 1st, it goes into crazy madness You know, we jump right into back to school dances, back to school things, and then right into homecoming season. And I know that as that volume is, it's right around the corner.
Um, I'm going to be so much more prepared for it this year, um, and those shows are going to happen a lot smoother without the phone calls of, Hey, how does this work? Or Hey, where does this go? And how does this thing happen? Uh, cause I've never seen your show before, you know, those, those questions should be minimized a lot, which is, which is wonderful.
And it makes doing the volume a lot easier.
Sean Walker: Totally dude. Do you, when you got busy weekends like that, do you hire a crew chief or a crew lead to go run around and, and take care of those shows or ancillary details for you? Like if you had Nick or somebody that works for you regularly that knows how all those go and you had 10 shows, could he run around and not be tied to a show site, but running around making sure each show is good and answering those questions for you so you didn't have to field all those phone calls or, or do you need him tied to a show?
Evan Turunen: What I normally do is I take my, I have the ten or so people that I hire most regularly, whether they're actually on staff or not, and each one of them goes to a site and acts as a site lead. So, I normally send, so for example, like the ten show day, um, ten of my best guys went out, one to each show site, and then ten just, People from my freelancer list went out as the second crew member because a lot of them are our two crew shows for,
Sean Walker: But at least one person on site had done it before I knew what was up and how to do it and it makes it easier. Yeah, there you go. That's great.
Evan Turunen: That's, that's kind of my, that's kind of my basis. And then if it's a bigger show, um, I might make that two people. You know, but as long as I have one person on every site that has done that show before, knows how I want it done, I'm comfortable.
Sean Walker: Yeah, that's awesome. That's awesome. And are you starting to book labor for those now where you're like, Hey man, I'm coming into August or September, whatever. I'm going to need you. I'm going to get you on some weekends here. Start penciling me in.
Evan Turunen: Yeah, exactly. And I mean, there might have to be some shifting around that happens between now and October 1st or whenever that date is.
Sean Walker: dude.
Evan Turunen: For the most part, yes. As I, as the show gets booked, the crew gets booked. So the second I get it, I get a booking, you know, reach out to, hey, do you want to do this show?
Um, because I don't want to be figuring that out in two months when I'm scrambling. I want to figure that out now and not have to worry about it.
Sean Walker: Totally. Totally.
Evan Turunen: Plus trying to, trying to do that while not on the road is also a lot easier because I'm not trying to tour and Manage a tour as a front of house engineer and run a company at the same time. So that makes things a bit easier as well.
Sean Walker: much easier. So much easier. Well, sweet dude. Thank you for freaking coming and hanging out. Thanks for sharing your updates and keeping us abreast of your journey. We're stoked that you're kicking butt and taking names.
Andy Leviss: and I got one more question, because now that we've got a sheet I can check to see that we didn't ask it to you last time. If we come to visit you, where should we go eat?
Evan Turunen: Oh, there's a great place, uh, up the road called the Twisted Sage Cafe. And you know, it's not too far from the shop and it is amazing. Breakfast,
Sean Walker: going.
Evan Turunen: we're going to go.
Sean Walker: going. Yeah, I'm in. I'm in. The flight, the flight's short and easy. I like cafes. Let's, let's do it. I'll come down and hang out. We'll call, we'll call our LA friends and go get some brunch.
Evan Turunen: Great. Let's do it.
Sean Walker: That's
Andy Leviss: Those are the times I'm jealous of how close y'all are to LA.
Evan Turunen: Yeah.
Andy Leviss: Being out here on New York and basically homebound the next few months waiting for the baby to
Sean Walker: Yeah, we'll send you eggs, bro. Just kidding. We'll send you pictures of eggs, you son of a gun.
Andy Leviss: Hey, I make a mean fucking scrambled egg
Sean Walker: I bet you
Andy Leviss: about it on the Discord. We didn't talk about it here. Now that I have the espresso machine
Sean Walker: Oh, snap.
Andy Leviss: there's uh, the fancy name is huevos al vapor.
Sean Walker: up, Cortado?
Andy Leviss: Yeah, well you don't want to do them at the same time because that gets weird. But yeah, you pretty much just take like a little A little pitcher, like Pyrex thing, you scramble a couple eggs in it with butter, and you do it right on the steam wand of the espresso machine, like just stirring it with a fork till it's almost but not quite
Sean Walker: What?
Andy Leviss: Yeah, and it's the most magical, fluffy, perfect scrambled eggs you've ever had. Little bit of a pain in the ass to clean the steam wand, because the egg bakes onto it, but worth it.
Sean Walker: All right. I'm booking flights to New York right now. That sounds good. I'm going, let's do it. I'm coming over.
Evan Turunen: Man, I will say, I put a, an espresso machine in my shop, um, once I moved in, and that thing gets used at every load in. Somebody is always making a cup right before we're loading a truck.
Sean Walker: Duh. Totally.
Andy Leviss: and I'll say, and I'll actually, I'll throw out the restaurant recommendation while we're on that front, that if you come to New York, uh, Buvette, and I'll have to look up the other name of the other place, there's two restaurants by the same chef that are known for brunch, and like, she's the chef who invented that like, steamed scrambled eggs thing, and it's one of the best brunch spots you can go to.
Evan Turunen: Nice.
Sean Walker: I mean, that sounds great. That sounds great. Well, thanks for hanging out with us for the hour, dude. We appreciate you. We're super stoked that you're fricking ripping and growing super fast. And we're stoked to keep checking in on your successful journey over the, over the next months, years, whatever.
Uh, thanks to RCF obviously for, for having us and Allen and Heath for being awesome and that's the pod y'all
Evan Turunen: Thanks guys.
Music: “Break Free” by Mike Green
